INDUSTRY, TRADE AND TOURISM

Mr. Deputy Chairperson (Ben Sveinson): This section of the Committee of Supply sitting in Room 255 will now begin consideration of the Estimates for Industry, Trade and Tourism.

It seems that we have a few minutes to wait.

Does the honourable Minister responsible for Industry, Trade and Tourism have an opening statement?

Hon. James Downey (Minister of Industry, Trade and Tourism): Yes, I have, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman, I, first of all, want to acknowledge the work of the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism in preparation of the Estimates and the work that they have done over the past, not only many months, but over the past several years. I have some prepared notes which I will refer to at this particular time.

Mr. Chairman, I am pleased to introduce the 1996-97 Estimates for the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism. I also want to acknowledge support that I have had from my colleagues in both cabinet and caucus in some of the major initiatives that we have been able to proceed with as a government. I want to, as well, acknowledge that Manitoba is in excellent economic state, and investors both within our province and outside are showing their confidence in Manitoba by investing in our future.

We have worked hard to create a strong, supportive environment for the creation of new wealth and industries. We are proud of our quality of life in Manitoba, and we know that our ability to sustain this priceless quality, as well as to create jobs and provide vital social services depends on a strong economy, and we are confident that our efforts are succeeding.

I would like to mention some of the strong indicators of Manitoba's economic performance. First, Mr. Chairman, I want to mention trade. Last year, our world exports grew to a record level of $5.44 billion, up 18 percent. We were the third amongst the provinces and above the national average. Our performance was led by strong gains in sales to our largest trading partners, the United States, Japan and China. In particular, we should note Manitoba's trade with United States which went up by some 21 percent, the second best amongst the provinces. Exports of our manufactured goods accounted for most of the increase led by transportation equipment, primary metals, machinery and paper products, again, products that have value added to them, particularly in the manufacturing sector. In fact, Manitoba's exports to the U.S. have increased by 124 percent since 1990, the best increase of any province and well above the national increase of 86 percent. Just think, a 124 percent increase since 1990 in one of our major markets.

I am pleased to add, Mr. Chairman, that our trade performance in general, especially with the U.S.A. continue to shine in the first three months of 1996, with an increase in exports of 17.3 percent over the same quarter in 1995. The national average was 2.1 percent.

* (1650)

Mr. Chairman, my department is committed to enhancing this phenomenal trade performance. In 1996-97 the department will increase its expenditures on trade related activities by close to $1 million. We will focus on and increase our efforts to expand Manitoba's trade with nations around the world. An international Business Services unit will provide information services and export training and awareness. Funding for the Trade Assistance Program which helps small and medium-sized firms to access new export markets will increase.

Turning to jobs, Mr. Chairman, in 1995, Manitoba employment grew by 10,000 jobs or 2 percent over the 1994 level, fourth amongst the provinces and better than the national average of 1.6 percentage points. We made gains in the important sectors of manufacturing, mining, forestry, agriculture, business services, transportation and communication. I think it is important to note at this particular time how important it is for Manitoba to have a healthy resource-based industry, clearly an indication--and we can refer to it as we go through the Estimates--of some of the very positive expenditures and investments that are made by the people within Manitoba, but also outside investment as they see opportunities develop in the environment which has been created here in Manitoba.

Our gains were 2.7 percent in the private sector, nearly all in full-time jobs, and our total growth has exceeded the national average in two of the past three years. Our unemployment dropped by 10,000 in 1995, the best improvement of any province and more than double the national improvement.

Mr. Chairman, according to Statistics Canada, our real GDP growth in 1995 of 2.5 percent was above the national average and third best among the provinces. Several prominent economic forecasters have forecasted strong growth for the Manitoba economy. For example, the Conference Board of Canada forecasts real growth of 2.3 percent in 1996, third best among the provinces and better than the national average of 1.9 percent. This is the second year in a row that we have performed better than the national average. In fact, five of the seven forecasters project Manitoba's real domestic growth will be at or above the average in 1996.

Last year our manufacturing shipments grew by 11 percent, the best annual increase since 1981. This growth continued into this year with a growth of 7.9 percent over the same 1995 period reported in the first quarter, second best amongst the provinces. The Conference Board expects after-tax personal disposable income per capita in Manitoba for 1995 to be up by $535 over 1994. This is an increase of 3.3 percentage points, second best in Canada and above the national average. The increased forecast for 1996 is $447 or 2.7 percentage points, also second best amongst the provinces. I think it is important to emphasize that again. Imagine, 1995 will be up over $535 over 1994 and 1996 over $447 of disposable income per capita in Manitoba.

Our retail sales are doing well. In the first quarter of 1996, the growth was 7.6 percentage points over the same period in 1995, more than double the national average and fourth best among the provinces. In the whole year 1995, the increase was 5.6 percent, second among the provinces and more than twice the national average.

In recent years we have been changing the operating priorities of the department. Instead of the department directly operating programs, we have been shifting to facilitating and acting as a partner in programs provided by third parties. This change in emphasis is in line with the 1994 report of the task force on capital markets which recommended the private sector, government, and the community should work together to expand capital markets in the province in order to facilitate the growth of business and jobs.

I want to at this time again acknowledge the hard work and effort of the task force on capital markets, the hard work and effort which they have put forward. I believe that we will be able to further confirm this, but I believe that almost all, if not all, of the recommendations have been fulfilled or are very close to being fulfilled from the work that those individuals did on behalf of the Province of Manitoba.

I would like to mention a number of programs that will be operated in partnership with the private sector in 1996-97. The Business Start program is a loan-guaranteed program to assist Manitoba entrepreneurs who are setting up new businesses. Loans up to $10,000 are available and are administered by participating financial institutions. Business training and counselling are integral parts of this program. In 1995-96, this program assisted with 90 business start-ups and the creation of about 200 jobs.

The Manitoba Business Expansion Fund will provide rapidly expanding businesses with higher risk working capital loans to expand their operations. Loans are delivered through commercial banks as incremental loans over and above a borrower's existing credit lines. We will contribute some $2.5 million to this fund over five years, Mr. Chairman, and we expect that this will lever some $43 million in commercial loans, the target loan range is $10,000 to $150,000. I think we should emphasize that again, that $2.5 million is expected to lever some $43 million in commercial loans in the $10,000 to $150,000 range. We expect this initiative to close the gap in funding working capital for expanding small businesses. The program may be stacked on top of the federal business improvement loan program to enable small businesses to qualify for a combined $400,000 in financing.

In addition, Mr. Chairman, these loans will be provided cost effectively by the lending institutions. We expect that about 450 businesses will be assisted and over 900 to 2,000 jobs created during the five-year life of the program.

Mr. Chairman, the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism has been a catalyst in the formation of the new Manitoba Capital Fund. This fund will tap private capital pools and pension funds to address subordinated debt needs in the range of some $250,000 to $1.5 million. The fund has raised some $25 million from the province, Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce, Civil Service Superannuation fund, Workers Compensation Board, and Manitoba Public Insurance Corporation fund. We expect this fund to provide substantial benefits to Manitobans.

First, an important new source of capital will be created for small- and medium-sized businesses to enable them to expand and create new jobs. Indeed, as many as 1,000 jobs may be created during the seven years of the program. It will strengthen Manitoba's capital markets by filling a void for subordinated debt financing in the form of subordinated debt loans. This ranks between conventional secured bank lending and equity. Also because of the nature of this form of financing, all investments will be for incremental economic activity. Because the Manitoba Capital Fund effectively transfers some of the operation of provincial financial programs to privately managed funds, administrative costs are reduced and the leverage of government support is maximized. The fund will complement the successful Vision Capital and Crocus Investment funds which are other initiatives of this government.

Mr. Chairman, I would further like to add that I would hope the members of the opposition and other members of the Legislature would help to encourage other funds, other retirement funds, to be part of this program because I believe, in principle, that the monies generated in this province to some degree, it would be very helpful to see them reinvested in these types of programs. I see an affirmative nod from the opposition critic that it is, in fact, those retirement funds that will help those people who have retired, help create jobs for their children and their grandchildren, and we believe that there is a direct linkage here that would be very helpful to help grow the economy, and I would appreciate support from the members opposite in encouraging some of their investments.

* (1700)

Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Without interrupting the minister's right to continue, I would be glad to endorse those remarks in terms of capital from retirement funds in particular. The minister may not realize this, but this was an integral portion of our 1995 platform in the provincial election, and one that is very important to us. We are glad to see the government getting around to implementing our platform.

Mr. Downey: It never troubles me, Mr. Chairman, to have the support of the opposition. As I said, this came from the Capital Markets Task Force, and I am pleased that the members of the opposition would like to attach themselves to good policy, and that is always important.

Mr. Chairman, I would like to mention yet another example of a program in partnership with the private sector. The Toronto-Dominion Manitoba fund--it will provide new and existing small businesses with Venture Capital loans up to $50,000 without the typical personal guarantees and security required under normal bank financing guidelines. This fund will fill the need to assist in the formation of new businesses, and enable our business sector to develop their ideas and products in Manitoba. We estimate it will lever an estimated $2 million in loans and make more capital available to Manitoba businesses. The fund will be open to all Manitoba-based businesses engaged in development, processing and manufacturing, with particular emphasis on tourism, high-tech and export-oriented firms, as well as information technology and knowledge-based industries.

I believe this is a good pilot project, and I am sure that we will see some major successes flow from it. Mr. Chairman, improving access to capital in co-operation with the private sector will be an ongoing priority of the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism.

Turning to the Agri-Food sector, the past year was, I think, one of an outstanding performance. This sector has been on the upswing for a couple of years. We expected the signing of the new gas and world trade organization agreements, plus the elimination of subsidies under the Western Grain Transportation Act to fuel the industry in the next few years. One may say that I could be referred to as maybe being supportive of the loss of the subsidy and the movement of grain out of western Canada. I would like to add that I am not particularly happy about the loss of the subsidy. What I am unhappy about is the fact that over the last 10 years we have spent some close to $10 billion supporting the two national railways with federal government money, money which, I believe, should have been paid directly to the producers so that they could have equipped themselves to be part of the changes that have to take place.

We have spent that money nationally, and I do not believe the rail system is working any better today than it was prior to the spending of that money. But the money is gone. So I am not happy the subsidy is gone; I am just unhappy with the way in which it was, in fact, taken away from the western Canadian industry in the manner of such short notice, but the manner which they had lost out on it as a farm community. I believe it was their subsidy, and they did not get the full benefits as they should have.

Mr. Chairman, the announcement last week of the location of the J. M. Schneider's new $40- million hog slaughtering and processing plant in Winnipeg highlights both Agri-Food's successes in the past year and the outlook for the future. This modern plant will quadruple Schneider's processing capacity in Manitoba. By next spring, the company will have a $17 million, 100,000 square foot cutting and processing plant, creating 325 new jobs. Depending on market growth, the second phase will see construction of a $23 million, 120,000 square foot slaughter and chill operation, increasing plant employment to some 500 people.

The Schneider's decision to build this plant reflects their confidence in the quality of hogs produced in Manitoba, producers' ability to respond innovatively to the needs of the world's markets, and our support in establishing a goal of doubling our hog production to some four million-plus hogs for commercial marketing by the year 2000.

Mr. Chairman, the McCain Foods has begun expansion of their plant in Portage la Prairie. This is a capital expenditure of some $75 million in two phases. By the end of 1996, they will have doubled the physical size of their plant, adding at least 120 production jobs to the existing 280 full-time positions. The Portage plant will be the most modern in McCain's worldwide operations. We are proud that Portage was chosen for this project because of its location, the quality of its raw potatoes, availability of irrigation, and the quality of the workforce. The additional potato line is expected to more than double production capacity to more than 350 million pounds of french fries a year. This will generate an additional 17,000 acres of potatoes, or double the plant's current supply, an estimated addition of some $25 million in farm gate value in Manitoba potato growers.

Mr. Chairman, the $18-and-a-half million expansion of Nestle-Simplot--and I have to say that that name has changed as of today, and my colleague the member for Turtle Mountain (Mr. Tweed), who is with us today, was out at that ceremony, where we will now see the Nestle-Simplot plant be called Mid-west Food Products Inc. So that is a major change by that company and will now be referred to as Mid-west Food Products Inc. I am pleased that my colleague was able to be there and participate in that activity, expansion done entirely by the private-sector results for that company's ability to produce quality french fries for McDonald's restaurants in the U.S. and other worldwide places. Canadian Agra Corporation of Kincardine, Ontario, has announced it will build and is building currently the canola crushing plant as the first phase of a sum $200-million integrated food processing operation in Ste. Agathe. The $55-million canola plant is scheduled to go into operation in late 1996, and we will have some 45 full-time jobs.

I am delighted to announce that my department is actively participating in matters relating to the Winnipeg International Airport development. Before I get into that, Mr. Chairman, could you tell me how much time I have left?

Mr. Deputy Chairperson: Eleven minutes.

Mr. Downey: Mr. Chairman, just in addition to that, as it relates to the development in agriculture, I would hope the member for Brandon East (Mr. Leonard Evans), when he makes reference to what is happening in Manitoba and his negative attitude, would take a look at what is happening in his own backyard where we see Simplot is investing some $200 million on their own, and they have another joint venture with a company out of the U.S., adding $33 million. In fact, at the peak season this year there will be over 800 construction workers in the Brandon area because of that major Simplot development. Tremendous employment opportunities, not only for the people of Brandon but will draw from all over Manitoba and probably western Canada.

The Winnipeg International Airport development, Mr. Chairman, or the Winnipeg Airports Authority, is expected to take over the responsibility for airport operations early next year. This will remove federal restrictions and facilitate related industrial development.

We are optimistic that Winnport Logistics will begin an air cargo service to and from Asia and Europe early next year. This will produce many benefits, including increased truck traffic to and from the U.S., activity in a new industrial park proposed for northwest Winnipeg and Rosser and significantly improved transportation services for Manitoba exporters. My department has an observer on the Winnipeg Winnport board and is participating in the advisory committee for the airport area plan.

Mr. Chairman, I would like to move to some other matters concerning the structure of the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism. This is a transition year as the Economic Innovation and Technology Council diverts its governance and responsibility for managing the Industrial Technology Centre and the National Agri-Food Technology Centre. In addition, a new course has been set--

Mr. Sale: The minister is a wonderful reader but I just missed that last sentence, and I wonder if he would be willing to repeat it.

Mr. Downey: Yes, Mr. Chairman, providing that I get the opportunity to finish my notes. With all these interruptions, I do not want that taken from my time.

Mr. Sale: Mr. Chairman, I have no problem with the minister finishing. If he requires a few extra minutes, I have no problem with that at all, as long as it does not turn into a few extra hours.

Mr. Deputy Chairperson: If I might ask all members to refer their comments to the Chair, and if you raise your hand or give me a nod, I will acknowledge you.

Mr. Downey: I thank you for that, Mr. Chairman, and I will repeat it. This is a transition year as the Economic Innovation and Technology Council diverts its governance responsibility for managing the Industrial Technology Centre and the National Agri-Food Technology Centre.

In addition, a new course has been set for the Environmental Sciences Centre to position it for a more business-like operation. Since April 1, ITC and NAFTC have been two of the government's special operating agencies reporting to my department and the Department of Rural Development, respectively.

ITC provides a full range of technical services to Manitoba companies in various industrial sectors and also to departments and agencies of federal, provincial and municipal governments. Clients vary in size from start-up entrepreneurs and existing small companies to large corporations seeking specific complementary technical assistance. ITC is also a partner with the National Research Council in the Industrial Research Assistance Program.

SOA status will give the centre the flexibility and power to pursue its goals of becoming more self-sufficient. One of its main objectives is to increase fee-for-service revenues and reduce its reliance on provincial funding. We are working to establish a public-private partnership to operate the Environmental Sciences Centre. This partnership is expected to help to further develop a competitive entrepreneurial focus for ESC as it continues to provide its technical services and analyzing water, waste water and biological samples.

* (1710)

I would like to turn to Tourism, where my staff have been very active in promoting the attractions, heritage and wide range of recreational activities awaiting visitors to Manitoba. Our efforts, particularly in nearby American states, are generating a lot of interest in Manitoba, and I am very pleased that more Americans, as well as Manitobans, are choosing Manitoba as their travel destination. Toll-free inquiries in 1996 increased by 37 percent over 1994. Our Information Centre registrations also increased by 3.8 percent. My staff answered a total of 158,000 inquiries generated by phone calls through our direct marketing promotions and through Information Centre registrations. Overnight arrivals at Customs in Manitoba by U.S. residents in 1995 increased by 2 percent over 1994. The total number of residents of other countries visiting Manitoba in 1995 was estimated at 65,000, up 5 percent over 1994. Re-entries from the U.S. by Canadian residents through Manitoba border crossings were down 9 percent in 1995, compared with '94.

The Winnipeg hotel occupancy rate in 1995 increased 7 percentage points over '94. The '95 rural Manitoba/Saskatchewan occupancy rate was also up by 7 percentage points. The Tourism staff are working closely with many partners in the industry to initiate and support a number of key projects. These include the development of a tourism strategy to support the targets of the framework for economic growth document, co-operative market planning with the tourism alliance for western and northern Canada, co-operative marketing with the Canadian tourism commission support of the Pan American Games to be hosted in Winnipeg in 1999.

Mr. Chairman, the 1999 Pan American Games are an exciting opportunity for all Manitobans to showcase our province. I am proud of the efforts of both the government and Pan American Games Society and the private sector to prepare for this great event. We are working with the society to capitalize on business development opportunities arising from the games and have developed the Pan American Games economic development initiative to support the games and related opportunities.

The department's executive director of Tourism is leading this initiative. The potential for tourism development has been identified as a key area of the initiative. Plans include such key things as product development opportunities, accommodation enhancements and infrastructure upgrading. Much of our thrust is based on the belief that growth in the north-south trade and tourism will generate important benefits for our province. This complements the larger efforts of the department to increase trade and opportunities south of the border.

Mr. Chairman, our efforts to keep taxes down, reduce Manitoba's debt, achieve and maintain a balanced budget and work as partners with business, instead of as a break on our initiative, have produced an economy that is well positioned to take Manitoba into a prosperous future in the next century. We look forward to the continued challenge of an opening up of Manitoba to the world in sending out Manitoba's message, all-Manitoba message, to our trading partners about the opportunities available in our province.

I am extremely pleased to introduce the department's Estimates, and, in my conclusion, I would like to, as well, make an announcement and produce a press release for the first time for the member. If I have the opportunity to read this into the record, I will: Business loans surpass job creation targets--again, important information. Manitoba government loans for business expansion have created hundreds of jobs, Industry, Trade and Tourism Minister Downey has indicated--and this is referring to the press release. The annual job audit for the Manitoba Industrial Opportunities Program, known as MIOP, showed businesses assisted by the program created a total of 1,875 jobs by the end of 1995, 837 more than contracted under the original loan agreement schedules. The results of the audit confirmed that Manitoba businesses are ready and willing to create jobs.

I think it is important to note, this is an audit which we have had done. I think the aim of the program is to encourage and lever greater investments; $71 million of MIOP investment has created some $257 million in private capital investment. The benefits are something like, $1 that has been invested by the province or expended by the province has generated a $4 return for the people of Manitoba. It is a program that is working extremely well. The success rate of the people who were involved in this program has been excellent.

I just want to say, Mr. Chairman, I want to again acknowledge the work of the Department of Industry, Trade and Tourism across the board for their hard work and efforts in all the initiatives that have been put forward on behalf of the government, and I look forward to the debate that will ensue in the Estimates process.

I will table this press release. Thank you.

Mr. Deputy Chairperson: We thank the minister for those comments. Does the opposition critic, the honourable member for Crescentwood, have an opening statement?

Mr. Sale: Mr. Chairperson, I will put a few remarks on the record. I want to, first of all, acknowledge and be very clear that I think that there are some good programs in the department, particularly in the area of capital leverage and in the extension of a much wider variety of Venture Capital and Venture Capital-like funds.

I think that over the last few years, the Canadian financial system has begun to recognize that its previously pretty hidebound approach to Venture Capital has strangled many promising smaller businesses, particularly, sole proprietorships that are beginning to start and cannot provide the kind of security for capital that has traditionally been required by pretty well all financial authorities of governments as well as banks. So I am pleased. I think the minister knows that I have supported the department's efforts to make a wider variety of Venture Capital arrangements available.

Let me say, as well, that I think it is important to be frank and direct in relation to what is happening in all developed nations' economies and, in particular, in the Canadian, and in this case, the Manitoba economy. There is a great struggle going on to reinvent our economies. The economy of 1996 is barely comparable to 1976, only 20 years ago. One looking back 20 years prior to that, to 1956, would see very few clear evolutionary patterns that were evident in 1956. We simply did not know what was going to happen to developed economies in terms of the explosion in the microelectronics field, the globalization of capital, in the development of service industries and in the tremendous development of value-added products. I suppose the clearest example for us in Manitoba are value-added agricultural products, but value-added products in general, I do not think anybody foresaw very clearly what was happening.

Now most economies in Canada and in developed nations have been struggling very hard with the trends that are evident in terms of job loss and job creation. We have had to run, as has every province in Canada, very, very hard just to stand still. I think it would be quite a bit more helpful to the public understanding of what is going on in our economy if the minister and the government were more forthright about the reality that many, many companies and individuals in Manitoba have made tremendous strides in replacing job loss in what are sometimes called smokestack industries but traditional industrial sectors.

With new jobs, there are all sorts of structural problems with those jobs. Many of them are part time, quite a number are not high wage, they are modest wage or low wage. We know that the emerging economy is one in which people have very little job security. That is something that troubles families, worries families greatly. I think any of us who are in urban areas--I know the minister is from a rural area, but I am sure he is familiar with the anxiety in those areas as well. Many of us who canvass regularly know that the biggest single anxiety that people of working age have is, where will my job be next year? Will I still have this job or will it be another job? If I have another job, will it be anything like the quality of the job that I have got now? Perhaps, it will be better, but in many cases, the fear is that it will be worse.

* (1720)

I would just recall for the minister that well over 2,000 workers in CNR in Transcona have lost their jobs in the last five years, that those were good jobs, good wages and very, very few of them have found equivalent jobs Most of them have found work, but the work has been of a substantially less secure nature at a lower wage.

I draw to the minister's attention something which I am sure he already knows, but the minister persists in putting on the record incorrect information or, perhaps at best, partial information about employment. I remind the minister that his department, Bureau of Statistics, issues a monthly report. If I go back to April 1994, just two years ago now, our seasonally adjusted workforce was 568,000; April '95, it was 565,000 people; April '96, 565,000 people. So there has been a very slight, probably statistically insignificant, shrinkage in our labour force. The Canadian labour force during that period of time has grown from 14,800,000 to 15,100,000. Not huge growth, but in the order of 300,000 growth.

If we look at the actual employment in the months in question, in April 1995, 512,000 people were employed in Manitoba. It does not much matter if you go to seasonally adjusted or not, it does not change the number at all. This year, in April '96, 513,000 employed. So the minister is partially correct that in the middle of 1995 there was growth and employment, but by the fall and winter of 1995 that had all disappeared. We were back to where we were a year before. So I think it would be considerably more helpful if the minister would perhaps simply put on the record that the government has been able to assist Manitoba businesses to create a number of jobs and that the job-creation rate has approximated the job-loss rate, and so we are running very hard and we are standing still. That is maybe not a bad achievement in the kind of economy that we are in.

But, when the minister tells Manitobans that there are 10,000 more jobs, and the Manitobans that I meet at the door and that he meets at the door still have sons, daughters, relatives, friends and neighbours who cannot find work, the result of that is a loss of credibility. A loss of credibility for the government and a loss of credibility for governments in general, whether it is this government or any other. I think that this minister knows probably better than any of us in this room that governments' credibility has been sorely tested over the last generation. It does not help that, when partial or less-than-accurate information is continually put out for the public's consumption, the public begins to say, well, this is interesting, but my experience and my neighbour's experience and, in fact, the numbers do not bear this out. So, in a sense, the emperor begins to be seen as having very few clothes on. That does not help government; it does not help Manitobans.

I would challenge the minister to be either more forthright or at least more complete in the information that is put forward. I point out that in April of '95 there were 46,000 unemployed; April of '96, there are 46,000 Manitobans unemployed. It is no change at all. If you go to seasonally adjusted numbers, it is the same, 42,000 in '95, 42,000 in '96. The unemployment rate is the same. Is that because the labour force has expanded? No, it has not. Actually, the participation rate has shrunk slightly; again, statistically insignificant probably, but a slight shrinkage of 0.2 percent. It is not a labour force change; it is not a participation rate change. In fact, we have created a number of jobs in 1995-96, and we have lost a number of jobs in 1995-96. The net effect has been a wash, not an improvement.

I would also like to put on the record that the employment growth record of this government has been very, very modest at best. During the years in which the NDP government of Mr. Pawley was in power, Manitoba employment grew at about four-fifths of the Canadian rate. During the Conservative years, Manitoba has grown at about one-third of the Canadian rate in overall employment growth, so not only was Manitoba's employment growth rate higher during the NDP years in government, but it was also closer to the Canadian average rate. We were both below the average rate, but the experience in Manitoba has been that it was substantially below during the Filmon years and only slightly below during the Pawley years.

If we go to actual jobs, Mr. Chairperson, during the years 1981 to '87 Manitoba realized 35,000 new jobs. The source of this number is Historical Labour Force Studies, Catalogue 71201 Annual, Statistics Canada 1995 issue. During the Conservative years 1988-1995, only 14,000 jobs were created. Now, those were tough years, and I have already put on the record that I think that all Canadian provinces have had to struggle during this very major structural adjustment to our economy, but for the minister to pretend that somehow the job creation record is different than that reported by Statistics Canada or the Manitoba Bureau of Statistics is not helpful to the record.

On average, during the NDP years 5,833 jobs were created. During the Conservative years 1,750 new jobs were realized on average. These data are available. I believe they were tabled in the House by our Finance critic, the member for Brandon , the Honourable Len Evans who is himself a statistician and of course worked for the Manitoba Bureau and for Statistics Canada at some points in the past. I would emphasize to the minister that I do not think this is about scoring points; this is about helping Manitobans to understand the structural changes that are going on in their economy, being with them as they recognize that they are running very hard to stand still, that in fact we still have an unacceptably high rate of unemployment.

If I might draw the minister's attention in fact to one of the things that government has been very proud of in Manitoba is the youth unemployment rate. Well, the youth unemployment rate year-to-date average both sexes is up January to April '96 over January to April '95. For 15- to 24-year olds both sexes, it is 15.1 percent now. It was 13.8 percent a year ago in that same period of time. So again, it would be helpful I think if we talked about the real world and then talked about what the government was doing to deal with that, rather than pretending the real world is different than it is and thereby inviting people to disbelieve government because of the reality of their own experiences.

In relation to trade data, Manitoba's export performance has been very strong, and there is nothing but celebration to have about that. I think that is a very, very good record; however, the net trade balance remains to be something of concern to us all. We have a negative trade balance of approximately $650 million which means in effect that we are shipping $650 million out of Manitoba each year to deal with that trade balance, we are buying more than we are selling.

* (1730)

In the case of the United States, the minister makes a strong case that exports to the United States have grown strongly, and indeed that is correct, exports grew by approximately 21 percent in my most recent data which is the end of 1995. But we still have a trade imbalance with the United States that is very, very significant. A trade imbalance last year was in the order of $1.280 billion for the year which means again that in relation to that particular trade sector, we are shipping $1.2 billion dollars to the United States from our very hard-earned income.

Mr. Deputy Chairperson: Order, please. I interrupt the proceedings of the committee. When we resume the proceedings, the member for Crescentwood will have 16 minutes remaining, if he wishes, on his opening statement.

The time being 5:30 p.m., the committee will recess until 9 a.m. tomorrow (Friday). Committee rise.